Monotype Moulds

Just Acquired/Rescued/Taken into Custodian-ship, complete Monotype Casting Plant.!!
First of several anomalies coming up, requiring a little help with,? - First up *Monotype Mould* 11,197 (below 22,000 series = NON constant height)
Re-Marked as L.P. seems to imply Long Primer. (that is the first query) Originally designated as 12 Point, .1667 x .918, now re-designated as .1350 x .918.
Must have been modified downwards from 12 Point, will cast some >Spaces< S.A.P. any thoughts/ideas welcome.
Although (apparently untried as yet) will cast good spaces, NOT type, ???

May equate to a Didot size, All/Any help welcome. Please & Thank,s.

Thanks Mick.

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Mick, I heard from John Eickhoff (Acorntype) years ago that he had a few comp. moulds in the pre-point sizes. Since Monotype quickly started making their own moulds in the early 1900’s, your hunch that LP is Long Primer makes a lot of sense. That would put it around 10 point. It is amazing what Monotype did in the old days. The mould in question has a round “Nick”, right? This would put it to pre-1920 production.

Dan

Here in Holland, I have quite a number of old type moulds, and they differ in many details. I have seen moulds with round nicks too. No one in my shop however.

Between them there are moulds at Dutch height .9875” (constant height), .987”, Belgium height .932”, French height .982” and English height .918”,

One mould is of American origin, and because the inside dept of matrices is smaller combined with an UK matrix this would produce French height. It however mismatched the caster. I had troubles to fit it on the machine…

Using other height moulds on your machine requires extra adjustments on the bridge, raising the mould a little bit etc. etc.

It took me a long time to figure this out. With the help of Gerry Drayton (93 years of age and still active at the Type Archyve in London UK) we could make this work.

Here in Holland the Monotype department did not spread the knowledge about this. They rather would take a machine adjusted to French/Belgium/English height to Amsterdam, revise it renew any possible worn part on it and sell it

Whenever you were so disobedient or imprudent to buy a cheap second hand composition caster in Belgium, Max Stiebner would be willing to help you out, the costs of this was in 5 numbers… He was the only man, capable to do this…

Even after Monotype stopped he was not willing to show how to to it.

Actual it needs only to change two parts on the machine, a Dutch typecarrier and a slide for the diecase, and 15 minutes work adjusting… He just only smiled, when I told him of my “discovery”. He was 101 years of age at that time…

……….

here a little list of old moulds in my shop: the oldest of it has a number as small as 3485, 10D on Dutch height…

14D 11941 F old type
14-24 pica 24P 2U 137A E large comp ?
14-36P S3686 E display mould
14-36D S2681 H display mould

14D S2974 H duplex
14D S3948 H duplex
14D 11869 H
14D 12419 H
14D 14763 H
14D 31091 H

14D S1167 B
14D 26003 E

13D 4183 H
13D 4354 H
13D 6697 H
13D 12409 H
13D 21333 H
13D 30164 H

13P 10742 E

12D 17079 H
12D 23802 H
12D 46819 H

12D 14625 E
12P 47045 E
12P 100654 E CH

11D 11517 H
11D 16891 H
11D 21447 H

10D 3485 H
10D 10573 H
10D 12472 H
10D 13963 H
10D 15330 H
10D 16916 H
10D 20780 H

10D 25187 F

…………

I might show all the differences between them

Mick, any pictures of these interesting moulds and the shop itself? Thanks in advance,
Dan

Dan J. Thank You for for Your initial input, the plot thickens, *as the saying goes* 11,197 ? actually has a square nick, (am familiar with square V round Nicks) thought that only applied to display Moulds, cast Display late 50,s through to late 70,s with both types, only came into contact with constant height (5 Pt. - 14 Pt.) well above 22,000 series.
Those turning up now, Non Constant height below 22,000 inc 13 & 14 Pt. will cast Good Spaces, but because of the Recess/Dent will not be casting 13 - 14 Type from good Die-cases.
Apologies no Pictures of the Shop,! - - A. It WAS in a private house. B. Tucked into every possible corner, C. mostly obscured. etc., etc.
Soon as possible/practical, will post some pictures, when the learning curve has taken an upward turn.

*****
One actual example that I have just examined, (Have only recovered/Retrieved a fraction of the Whole so far),?
A mould marked S 5675 2 Pt. ??? Is in fact a short Lead and Rule mould, presumably for precise lengths of 2 Pt. Leads and Rules for ledger work and invoice,s etc, £ s d. etc. Probably of no practical use nowadays, but to imply That the Mould & The Box are pristine would not be an understatement.! Almost like they left Redhill last month, not last century.

*****
Long time ago met John Eickhoff, we did a little swap barter etc., via a Sale/Auction in Bath, we bought jointly a whole *Herd* of moulds, and split 50/50 ish, but I ended up with Many Display size Mats, Ornaments etc., which John, virtually snatched my arm off for, Bristol to Brighton, not exactly on the doorstep. !! Dan Thank You

John Cornelisse, Thank You VERY MUCH as well, I am still halfway back through the last Century, (unfortunately) but my learning curve is progressing in leaps and bounds,
to date, my only involvement with *Continental Type* was to >lock up< FACE DOWN, a whole forme of French height Type, and plane a FEW (thou) off, of, the feet with the Kearney & Trecker, milling machine, worked well, along side English Height type.
John C. Thank You, again. Mick